From Battlefield to Balance: Military Athletes, Brain Injuries, and Finding Purpose After Service

 This episode explores the shared experiences of military athletes and veterans, focusing on brain injuries, mental health, identity after service, and the pursuit of purpose. Through stories of post-9/11 Iraq, selection pipelines, and life in the 173rd Airborne, Deny Caballero and Bradley Pennington discuss growth, vulnerability, fatherhood, and alternative healing paths for veterans.

Topics Covered:
 • Military athletes & elite performance
 • Brain injuries & mental health
 • Post-9/11 military culture
 • Selection processes & resilience
 • Psychedelics, mindfulness & healing
 • Veteran community & purpose

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Chapters:
00:00 – Military Athletes & Shared Pressure of Performance
 01:35 – Maintaining Standards in Sports and Military Service
 04:25 – The Overlap Between Athletics and Combat Culture
 08:12 – Joining the Military: Recruiters and Early Decisions
 14:09 – How 9/11 Changed Military Culture Overnight
 19:03 – Early Combat Experiences in Iraq
 22:40 – Selection Processes and Mental Resilience
 25:33 – Lessons from Selection and Personal Growth
 27:27 – Life with the 173rd Airborne in Europe
 29:45 – Skydiving, Risk, and Team Bonding
 32:39 – Balancing Adventure, Family, and Fatherhood
 35:31 – Walking, Mindfulness, and Problem Solving
 38:05 – Finding Purpose After Military Service
 40:38 – Building and Sustaining Veteran Community
 49:54 – Personal Struggles, Trauma, and Identity
 51:57 – Alcohol, Mental Health, and Veterans
 54:44 – Psychedelics, Mindfulness, and Healing
 01:00:06 – Transformational Experiences and Growth
 01:05:25 – Navigating Mental Health Resources
 01:09:04 – Supporting Veterans Through Connection
 01:14:42 – Paying It Forward to the Next Generation

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Chapters

• 0:00 From Team To Isolation
• 1:57 Guest Intro And Setup Chaos
• 3:35 Athletes, Veterans, And Brain Injury
• 6:35 Overlap Of Identity Loss
• 10:55 Airborne Hits, Concussions, And Jumps
• 14:30 Night Drops And Sicily DZ Realities
• 15:50 Why He Joined And Job Corps Path
• 19:50 Contracts, Airborne, And 9/11 Shift
• 23:20 Iraq Push And MSR Tampa First IEDs
• 27:20 Bad Armor, Heavy Loads, Hard Lessons
• 30:15 DIY Up-Armor And Field Fixes
• 31:50 Selection Attempts And Setbacks
• 35:00 Civil Affairs Detour And Europe Orders
• 37:10 173rd Deployments And VBIED At Bagram
• 40:05 Air NCO And Falling For Skydiving
• 44:25 Family, Risk, And Choosing Hard Things
• 47:40 Walks For Clarity And Stoic Tools
• 52:10 Purpose After Service And Swaggy Vets
• 56:40 Identity, Therapy, And Taking A Knee
• 1:02:35 Alcohol, Suicide, And Accountability
• 1:07:20 Psychedelics, Mindfulness, And Safety
• 1:13:40 Faith, Fatherhood, And Healing

Transcript

SPEAKER_01: 0:00

You go from being a part of a team, having camaraderie, teaching, mentoring, training soldiers. You do it for an exuberant amount of time, and then you get out and you're just by yourself in a truck hauling oil. Exactly. I ended up moving back here, and it's just I couldn't find my purpose yet. So I was just going job, worked at Lowe's, delivering appliances. Then I didn't feel fulfilled there. I was just, you know, working. And then I ended up getting a job hauling fuel, going to the bulk places in Nashville, grabbing fuel, and then delivering it to different gas stations.

SPEAKER_00: 0:37

So you probably dealt with a little bit of depression. You probably dealt with a lot of the voices saying, like, you're alone.

SPEAKER_01: 0:42

I felt like the world was on my shoulders. I didn't know how to problem solve and deconflict because this is stuff I've never dealt with. Somebody had to pull me to the side and said, hey man, you're just a number. You need to take care of yourself.

SPEAKER_00: 1:09

Well, shit, Bradley from Swaggy Vets. Welcome, Security Hall, man. How you doing?

SPEAKER_01: 1:14

Man, I appreciate you having me on. I'm doing great, man. Enjoying this uh day off, but then I work seven days straight. So I'm here spending my time with you, brother. I appreciate you bringing me on.

SPEAKER_00: 1:24

Dude, I appreciate you um swinging with the punches, man. It's been a crazy morning for me. Got a lot of stuff on the backside I gotta do. So I'm like fucking getting phone calls. I'm like fucking getting last-minute gear set up. And it's just like, fuck, I didn't sell the link. I didn't send the Candler invite. I didn't send this. Like, so my apologies, homie.

SPEAKER_01: 1:42

It's a lot of moving parts, bro. Huh? To go in there, you're gonna go live and stuff, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 1:47

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's um, so I produce other shows and we'll be doing broken brains live out there. And uh it's gonna be it's gonna be awesome, man. The the the foundation that uh sponsors that podcast does a lot for athletes, both professional youth, amateur sports, and veterans when it comes to concussion and uh brain injury. So that's gonna be a big thing, dude.

SPEAKER_01: 2:11

That's some good uh advocation right there.

SPEAKER_00: 2:14

Oh yeah. Yeah, dude. I was uh I never realized how much we had in common with NFL players when it comes to our military and the experience. I always thought I'm like, look at these dudes. They're fucking miles away from us.

SPEAKER_01: 2:27

That's real funny you said that, man. Swaggy Vets, we're about to start a new segment called Life After Sports.

SPEAKER_00: 2:33

Oh, nice.

SPEAKER_01: 2:34

And we got we got a new our first uh our first guest is gonna be Darius Holland. So he's the Super Bowl champion with the uh Green Bay Packers. Then he played 10 years in the NFL, then came in the military.

SPEAKER_00: 2:49

Damn.

SPEAKER_01: 2:50

Yeah, he's 52 years old. He just made the majors list. He's a chaplain in uh chaplain in uh in Chicago. I just talked to him the other day. He's like, man, it's code. I don't like this code.

SPEAKER_00: 3:01

Yeah, dude, I um I had a really awesome experience. I got to do two programs with the Best Defense Foundation up at their their um retreat in the um in Utah, and they pair special operators with NFL players, and the discussions were identical. We tend to think these guys get out with millions of dollars. More often than not, if they don't hit that four-year period, if they don't have the invested time to get that pension, and they didn't have you know supporting crew of people that would help them with their financials, they're getting out of their careers uh not in the best financial standings. And they're dealing with the same mental health issues and the same uh repeated head impact issues. So it blew my mind when these guys were talking, and I'm like, fuck, like you're dealing with the same identity and same lack of purpose as we're doing. I'm like, holy shit.

SPEAKER_01: 3:56

100%. And that and that's the whole reason we started that segment uh because it correlates to the military. It overlaps so much again.

SPEAKER_00: 4:04

Yeah, I didn't realize it until I got much older. But I remember looking back, I don't know if you remember a cat named Glenn Coffey. Um prominent Coffey. Yeah, it was a prominent college athlete. I think he played a few years pro, but then went in the military, and things didn't go well for him. I think he got in a lot of trouble. But when I re when I now that I know all this stuff about repeated head impacts, what it what brain injuries do to your personality and your mood and your ability to have solid judgment, this cat got stationed in Florida at um RTV, six RTV up there down at Swamp Face, and that's just a stone to throw away from seventh group. So we would see and hear about all of his crazy antics at the clubs at on the weekends, and we're like, dude, this dude's he's pushing it. This dude's gonna be like arrested in no time. And sure as shit, with I think it was within like two years of being stationed down there, that dude got uh kicked out of the military. Oh man.

SPEAKER_01: 5:06

Yeah. Yeah, he's from Fort Wanton Beach, so yeah. Yep. So that was good for him to be there. That's probably why he was getting what he was doing, what he was doing.

SPEAKER_00: 5:15

You would think, you would think like, oh man, you know, uh, you know, hometown boy does right, comes back, serves in the military, gets stationed at home. It would have a happy ending. But um, yeah, it's it's it it affects affects everybody, man.

SPEAKER_01: 5:28

I think I now that you say that, I remember them giving him praise for leaving the military for leaving the NFL to go to the military.

SPEAKER_00: 5:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 5:35

Yeah. See his face. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 5:37

Yeah, it was a it's a big deal. But now on this side, and and older, wiser, you realize that, man, these cats were getting in trouble that had these prolific high schools, because we have a lot of dudes in the military that do great in high school, they do great in college, something happens, and then they they enlist, and we see a lot of behavioral issues, we see a lot of mental health issues, and we just think, oh, they're just messed up. Get them out of the military. In reality, underneath all that contact sports, there's probably underlying diagnosis of brain issues. And we're not doing a good enough job of like helping those cats out. So that's uh that's a big thing that I'm a big passion advocate for and bringing more awareness because uh we're dealing with it too in the military, man. I haven't met one cat in an airborne unit that didn't get rocked.

SPEAKER_01: 6:20

Oh my God. Man, I'm gonna tell you, I got 61 static line jumps, and I've hit like a sack of crap the entire time. But some of them you sit there, you feel sorry for yourself for about five minutes, then you recover your parachute, move on to the objective. So I know what you mean, man. I'm a big dude. I was like 250 when I was, you know, doing airborne operations.

SPEAKER_00: 6:44

Yeah. It takes a toll on your body, man. But I I remember so many times you'd find one of your friends, or it was you. You're just walking in circles uh after a mass attack, and people are like grabbing you to the link up area. It's just like, yeah, give him a little bit, he'll be fine after a few minutes.

SPEAKER_01: 7:01

I'm sure you've did your fair share of mass tacks on uh Sicily drop zone, haven't you? Bro.

SPEAKER_00: 7:07

Bro. It's it's hard to explain if people have never done it. Like, I'm a free fall guy and like I love free fall. I I think even though I've had a lot of concussions from bad landings, it's still a lot safer, a lot safer, and it's a hell of a lot more fun. But nothing, nothing is like Sicily at nighttime, and you're listening to your friends fucking like equipment coming off. Yep. I remember I had a Kevlar hit like, you know, somebody came out, didn't have proper body position. Kevlar came right off. I just remember that thing hitting right next to me. I'm like, fuck me. Yeah. That's God watching out, man.

SPEAKER_03: 7:52

Oh, absolutely, man. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 7:54

So man, let's dive into your story, dude. What uh how how did you find yourself in the military?

SPEAKER_01: 8:01

Well, I was so I actually had a little I had a rough childhood, man. Um live with my mother. She was on drugs really bad, so she sent me to live with my dad. So my dad wasn't the best father in the world. So I ended up going to Job Corps. No shit. Yeah, man. I went to Job Corps when I was 17. And that's when I met my recruiter. And you know how recruiters he was a slick talker too, man. I went to Gainesville Job Corps, Gainesville, Florida, and he was a little slick talker, man. Had me thinking army's the best thing, which he did his recruiter thing. So I mean, Gain uh Job Cor was a gold mine for him. He was putting in like 10 people a month. He got his ring and all that type of stuff, man.

SPEAKER_00: 8:54

Bro, I never hear another I haven't heard a commercial for Job Corps in my adult life, but I remember hearing them all the time when I was a kid. All the time. Ah, damn.

SPEAKER_01: 9:06

Well, what I what I loved about Jobcor is I went into this thing called pre-law. So pre-law taught you how to be a corrections officer. So we had the discipline, we did drilling ceremony and stuff, and then I worked with my recruiter and got this letter, so I was able to come in as an E3, get a little extra pay for doing stuff in Jobcore, so that was cool. And then um just yeah, after that, uh it's funny, man, because they I got to Met.

SPEAKER_02: 9:36

I scored bad on my ASVAB because I ain't been in school in a while, and I pressed C for every answer.

SPEAKER_01: 9:47

I ain't got time for this. Exactly. I pressed C for every answer, but I ended up scoring a 35 on my ASVAB.

SPEAKER_00: 9:55

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SPEAKER_03: 10:54

So I went and talked to the lady.

SPEAKER_01: 10:56

She's like, Well, you can go infantry. We give you a$20,000 bonus. But the thing was, my uncle, uh, he's a retired two-star out of the Air Force. And he was kind of like my dad. He kind of like raised me. And for some reason, he always said, Whatever you do, don't go infantry. So that's playing in the back of my mind while I'm sitting there talking to the lady. I was like, Well, what's you know, I kind of asked her, What temperature was? She's like, Well, if you want to roll around in the dirt and do a bunch of stuff, infantry's for you. I said, Well, no. What else you got? She said, Well, we got this communications job. I was like, Well, what does it do? He's like, Well, if you want to run behind a truck hollering some wire, then this one's for you. I said, Well, no. She said, Well, we got truck driver. I said, Well, okay, that sounds cool. Give me truck driver. So it ended up being an 88 mic. And then uh and then it's funny, they had airborne in my contract already. They ain't tell me they had airborne. I looked, I said, airborne. I said, airborne, what's what's that? Well, if you want to jump out of planes, I was like, jump out of planes? No, I don't want to jump out of planes, so they so they ended up taking it off. But I think what happened was since they had airborne there, I was already assigned to the 82nd Airborne Division because I came in in 2001, February.

SPEAKER_03: 12:24

Oh shit.

SPEAKER_01: 12:25

So you had to be airborne to be in the 82nd back then. I get to Fort, I went to basic training in Fort Benning, the BCT. So I got there and I saw all the airborne paratroopers running around looking high speed with the berades and stuff. I said, you know what? I want to go airborne now. But it just so happens when I got to AIT, I was already picked to go airborne. For some reason, I don't know why this, I don't know how this happened. I guess this is God's way of saying you needed to go airborne. So I ended up, you know, being a holdover in AIT for airborne school. So, and went to airborne school, man. And and it was really cool, man, because airborne school, you know. And I was talking with uh we had a Navy guy that went to uh airborne school. He's like, Yeah, the army give it up to the army for making a a a three-week course when you can do it in four days, four or five days. So yeah, that's the army, man. Yeah, man. So had that, went there, but uh ground week, I was there in July, you know, bending is hot and oh man, bro, it's a different type of heat without humidity.

SPEAKER_00: 13:38

That's crazy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 13:40

But luckily, July 4th was on that Wednesday during ground week. So we had the day off. I just slept all day, man. I was so tired of falling those first two days. Yeah, man, and then finished that went to my unit. So when it came to went to Fort Bragg, I was in uh the Delta Company 782nd. Hell yeah. Mean support battalion.

SPEAKER_00: 14:04

Yeah. You know, and um, dude, by the time you got there, you know, the world was a little bit different, you know.

SPEAKER_01: 14:13

I so I got there August, so right before 9-11.

unknown: 14:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 14:18

I was I I I signed into my unit August 3rd. I got to Delta Companies. Uh August 3rd. No, no, no, I got the replacement August 3rd. Did replacement, you know, we do our PG tests and all that, and then go to our units. And yeah, man, right before 9-11. So yeah. It's a whole different army. Yeah, so very different army because Fort Bragg was wide open. We didn't have no gates, no nothing back then, man. It was just you could drive right on.

SPEAKER_00: 14:45

Yeah. So there's a whole half of Fort Bragg that most people never even go to. Oh, by Chicken Road and stuff? Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a whole other side of Fort Bragg that motherfuckers never experienced.

SPEAKER_01: 14:57

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00: 14:59

Dude. So, what was it like that that um that shift, that culture shift? I gotta imagine, like, you know, there's commanders have to do their their dog and pony show and and give that mandatory courage talk, but the things change culturally within the 80-second overnight. Like, hey, we're going to war. At some point, we're going to war.

SPEAKER_01: 15:23

Yeah, 9-11 happened, and then, yeah, right away, you know, they have so we have a platoon always at the we call it the DRB, the defense readiness. So you, you know, you get the Red Corvette. Red Corvette. So you get the call, we and we have to have our bags packed and uh ready to go because it, you know, 82nd is known for being anywhere in the world in 18 hours.

SPEAKER_00: 15:50

Wheels up, ready to go.

SPEAKER_01: 15:52

Wheels up, baby. Yeah, so I wasn't part of that, but one of our platoons was, and they got the call, and they went to I think it was late 2001, early 2002, they went to Afghanistan. So I was like, man, I wanted to go bad, but it just wasn't our time, man.

SPEAKER_00: 16:12

Yeah, a lot of time a lot of people think that the especially because, you know, 20 plus years now, a lot of people think that the reaction was swift and like, yeah, we had guys on the ground, we had certain elements in there, but the big army is still a big army. A lot of things gotta move. Then we had Iraq at the same time, and that's where guys started seeing like we were immediately people were thinking, oh, we're gonna go to Afghanistan, we're gonna go to Afghanistan. When I talked to my the guys that were ahead of me, the guys that were, you know, my my mentors, coaches, and the senior grunts I finally were able to get to talk to when I finally got to the 82nd. They're like, dude, we we thought we were going to Afghanistan. The next thing we know, fucking Iraq.

SPEAKER_01: 16:54

Yeah, because our guys were still over there. Then we got the orders, hey, we're headed to Kuwait. You know, you know, we got there uh right in 2003, I think end of January 2003, you know, get ready to go do the initial push in March. So yeah, I mean, it was all chaos. But you know, as we do, we took over Iraq in two weeks.

SPEAKER_00: 17:20

Yeah, 88 mics don't get a lot of credit, and I think a lot of higher profile mission units get a lot of highlight in the days, but in the early years of Iraq and Afghanistan and those early pushes into these combat zones, you weren't getting airlifted. You weren't getting these fancy, you know, rotary wing assets to lift you and your boys in. You're driving. You're driving light skinned vehicles. You're driving uh Hammett, or not Hammets, but um the uh the 1088, the character trailers. Yeah. Yeah with that's what I was in. With uh that soft cargo netting on top to make you feel like start coming.

SPEAKER_01: 18:02

Let me tell you, they made us put sandbags on the floor. They made us I don't know, I guess they think that was gonna help with the blue IED blast or something like that. But we didn't see our first IED until gosh. August. They that's when they started with the IED. And I remember I was on MSR Tampa and they had hung a 155 round on the back of the guardrail on the road. So we went by and I just heard a loud boom and seen the the and I'd never seen like anything like this in my life. This was a culture shock to me. And just the the the soil just blew up in the air like it's a cartoon. I'm like, oh my god, what is that? You know, I'm 20, 21 years old, uh specialist Pennington, not knowing really anything, just hauling. I think I had some we had some uh water on the back of our truck taking it to a a fob somewhere. So I'm like, man, what is this?

SPEAKER_00: 19:04

This is crazy. I didn't the the guardrail tactic, it was it was effective. It was so effective that there was a knee-jerk reaction that instantly they were pulling guardrails off the entire country. The entire fucking country. Like that's like the the like the the mindset of like fuck this is this is working so fucking good. We have to remove every guardrail. Like I remember, I remember seeing like they were just being torn off, cut off, and just constantly removed. Um what else did you guys see in those early years?

SPEAKER_01: 19:39

So, oh my gosh. This one mission, we went in um after the line unit secured a bunch of 155s, they had the 60s, they had the 120s, um, a bunch of landmines and everything, and they said, We need this truck to go pick up all this stuff. So me. Not knowing, I'm fresh, not really knowing how to load a truck. We loaded about 50 155 rounds on the back of my bed of my truck. Then we put the landmines and everything, but you know how much the 155 rounds weigh. So we put them right on the tire. I didn't even, I didn't know what I was doing. And I, by the grace of God, our tires didn't pop. You know, we we didn't have any blowouts or anything. But I think back now, if we would have hit an IED, I'd have been pink miss with all that freaking ordnance on the operated dog. Yeah, man. I'm just like, if I'd have known now, if I'd have known back then when I know now, I'd be like, I'm not getting that stuff. Hey, but I took all commands from the tower, and that's what we did. We executed.

SPEAKER_00: 20:52

Yeah, man. It it's you're 20-something in a war doing your best to comprehend what to do. A lot of people don't realize the amount of the lack of guidance, the lack of information that just isn't there. You have to figure it out. You have to figure it out as a young kid, man. And we didn't even have comms in our truck. Yeah, that's that's the other thing that's crazy. Like this is before BFT, this is before M MS, uh, was it uh uh MTS 2000, the other one.

SPEAKER_01: 21:22

All that stuff before the Duke systems and electronic warfare, yeah, man.

SPEAKER_00: 21:27

Yeah, it it's funny to see the evolution of warfare throughout the GWAT and and seeing it progress and talking and collecting these stories from different guys. Had a great friend, another 88 Mike. Uh they were welding pieces of steel to the side of vehicles. Yep.

SPEAKER_01: 21:43

Yep. Yeah, they were doing that. Uh we when we were ripping out uh units were implementing that SOP. We didn't do it, but for some reason, we had a guy in our unit higher up that thought putting mud on our truck to paint it, because they were green. So we we want to make it tan color. So we went out there with five-gallon jugs of water, mixed it with sand, and rubbed it on the side of our truck to make it tan. Why? I don't know. This was a task that I had me and my uh co-driver had to do. Damn.

SPEAKER_00: 22:20

Fucking thank you, sir. I call them the gifts a good idea, fairies. Yeah, dude. And uh did you stay your entire career at 82nd? I see you got a 173rd. Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 22:47

So yeah, I spent time in um I so here's here's my I I try to do a couple things. I went to selection in 2000. Yeah. So we I was actually in selection um during Thanksgiving. We had Thanksgiving in selection.

SPEAKER_00: 23:05

Oh man.

SPEAKER_01: 23:06

Yeah. So I did really good on my on my D Lab. Uh I scored like a 45 on my D Lab or 50. I think it was either 45, 50, something like that. It was pretty good. Got to selection, I did really good. This is when they had the 18x rays. So this 18x-rays, man, they were rock stars. You know, they're doing uh SOP C and then going to selection. So I was actually keeping up with them on the rucks and runs, which surprised me because I trained really good for selection. But for some reason, I just was not good at Land Nav, man. I I remember the first night of the star course, we got our first point, it was 10 clicks, and I was just I was just intimidated, man. I found uh I yeah, I found one point one night and then two points the next night, and then moved on to team week and did our ruck after that, but just didn't select it, man. It was it was disheartening, but you know, it is what it is. It definitely uh toughened me up mentally, like no, I could get through this, but eventually I went back to my unit, we deployed again and uh came back. I did three deployments with 82nd. Actually, no, I'm sorry, two. No, three. Three so long ago.

SPEAKER_00: 24:22

Dude, I know. Trust me, this is not a gotcha moment.

SPEAKER_01: 24:27

So yeah. So after that, I tried to uh I tried to go civil affairs. So I actually got I got picked up for civil affairs, they gave me French. Um so we went I actually uh out processed from 82nd, went over to uh, you know, when after you get selected, you get the little swick patch. The swick patch. Yeah, we had the swick patches on, and we were technically in a swick unit. And then uh this was ours, our class was the second class to do the selection. So we took our PT test, so boom, knocked out my push-ups, did an amazing amount of push-ups, then I went to do my sit-ups. I had taken the lining out of my shorts, and I didn't have any underwear on because I didn't wear underwear for some reason that day. So I'm doing my sit-ups, I'm banging them out, and my you know how your shorts ride up when you're doing the sit-ups. So I stopped to fix my shorts and he said terminated.

SPEAKER_00: 25:27

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SPEAKER_01: 26:20

Right before I could even get the past it. So I mean, I was so dishearted. And then after that, so process out, and that's when I came on orders for Europe. I went to the 173rd.

SPEAKER_00: 26:30

Yeah, that's not a bad, that's not a bad way to get. Uh things that's a big gift, man. It's a big gift from God. Yeah. I think that every soldier, and I know it's controversial. I think every soldier should at least try to go to a selection. Whatever, man. Whatever it is, I think you learn something about yourself when you go through something like that. Whatever selection process, whether it's in I I make fun of SFAB all the time. I don't, it's not because I truly hate you guys. It's just, you know, it's a you know, we're military, man, we pick on each other. But I think every soldier has to challenge himself to to grow, to be willing to take a chance, take a chance at life, man, be willing to try for something. Even if you don't succeed, you can chalk it up and say, hey man, I didn't I didn't let fear keep me from trying.

SPEAKER_01: 27:15

Yeah, I I I did learn some stuff about myself during selection. I learned I could push my body farther than I thought I could. Fuck yeah. So it it actually um it was kind of like a divine intervention with myself, you know, mentally. You know, I can know I could push myself harder. So it was good, man.

SPEAKER_00: 27:34

That's a gift, man. That's a gift a lot of people don't get. Because you you I know that I've put myself in situations by choice where I was straight sucking, and I'm sitting there like, man, this fucking sucks. Why did I choose to do this? And I realized I'm like, wait a second, you might be older, you might have chosen to do something really dumb, but that young 20-something of you that that's in you, he's done harder things before you can do it again. Absolutely, man. And uh, yeah, you definitely ain't you know, maybe have a little bit uh longer recovery when you get done with that. Uh but when you prove to yourself that you've done hard things, you can do them again. It it it it's been shown. It it does something to your brain. It helps neuroplasticity. That's why there's always a big challenge. There's always, you know, a lot of people saying, hey, go do something hard for the big for the new year. Start off the new year doing something hard. Physically, cognitively, challenge yourself to do something hard. Whether it's running a friggin' marathon or even running a 5K, be willing to challenge yourself. It's important to do that. Uh e even for for us older guys, we gotta we gotta do it.

SPEAKER_01: 28:40

Absolutely, man. I I try to do, I try to take the David Goggins approach, do something that sucks every day. Yeah, yeah. You know, so that's that's that's what I try to do, man.

SPEAKER_00: 28:51

Yeah. How do you like the 173rd?

SPEAKER_01: 28:54

I loved Europe. Like I really loved Europe. I think uh I loved it a little too much because I got over there. You know, I was a single guy and you know, enjoying myself, you know. So but I did uh I deployed with the 173rd. Right when I got there, we were on orders to deploy. So I got there March 2012, and then we ended up deploying in July. So was able to hang out a little bit, have some fun right before deployment. Then we deployed, we were over at Fobb Shank. Um and we were running missions, man, and then I we were actually we had run a mission to to Bogram, and then while we were in Bogram, there was a big 5,000 pound V bid that went off right beside one of the like the cooling yard for the jingle trucks. So yeah, so our tents were over by the aisle, everything got destroyed, man. So we had to stay in Bagram like for extra two, three weeks. We were just sitting there doing nothing. So we just what what what do we do when we're not doing nothing when we deploy to the gym? That's all we did. The gym and chow. An occasional PS room. But yeah, I I actually like the the 173rd. I did a lot of cool stuff. I um I went to job master school there. I was the air NCO for a while. I really like that. That was a chill job.

SPEAKER_00: 30:25

Oh, bro, that is that is the the fucking cheat code. Yeah, man. For a good NCO, maybe maybe he's like, you know, trying to rehab an injury, bro. Air NCO all fucking day.

unknown: 30:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 30:38

I was loving it, man.

SPEAKER_01: 30:39

Just putting people on jumps. That's all I did.

SPEAKER_00: 30:43

Oh man. You know, uh big Cromartie, man, rest in peace. He was our our and our air NCO for a long time. He he got injured, had to rehab his back, but uh, you know, he eventually took our platoon, um, not with us anymore, sadly. Um, but it it is a great position for somebody that if you're if you're good at connecting, because you get to know fucking everybody, man. That is uh that's a cheat code right there, dude.

SPEAKER_01: 31:09

Yeah, I was able, so and that was when I so I went on a jump. We jumped with the SF guys um in Stuttgart. I did a it was my first time doing a C-130 tailgate with the MC6, and I fell in love with it with that, even though the drop zone was really small over there. But I was asking one of the SF guys, I'm like, hey man, how's you know free falling? How does this compare? Because MC6 is semi-sterable. So I he's like he's like night and day, man. He's like nothing compares. No. So I was like, man, I want to skydive now. So I actually met there was a guy that worked at the MWR, a civilian guy named Marty. Uh Marty is a uh he's an old SF guy who actually was an instructor in Halo School. So he we had a drop zone at in Italy. Once I he told me, hey, I'll teach you how to skydive. So and he took me, I did my first tandem, loved it, and then he taught me how to jump. I got my A license. Nice, dude. Yeah, it was really cool. It was kind of scary jumping my own pack at first. But it was cool after that, man. I loved it. It was it was a rush. It's something I'd never done before, and I really I fell in love with it, man. But it's an expensive hobby, though.

SPEAKER_00: 32:38

It is an expensive hobby. It is the it is the greatest thing. And I will tell you this, man. Like, if you have a group of friends that all jump, that's where it's at. When you're, you know, like I I got lucky. I I got my license, and my roommate was also the 18 Charlie on my team. So we would go jump together. And I mean, it it was a blast. You go jump with a teammate on the weekends, and it's funny because the range uh that after you got done jumping for they, they had a range right there out in uh uh it's over past uh Christ forget the name of the place. I'll look it up, I'll give you a shout-out, I'll put it out there in the episode description if I can remember it. But it was one of the best times of my life being able to like work on your proficiency on something you love that you're doing in uniform, but do it with friends on the outside. Once once you run out of friends or people get, you know, get out of the military, people transition, leave. Kind of just sucks doing it by yourself and trying to connect with people, but nothing beats doing it on a free fall team. Absolutely, man.

SPEAKER_01: 33:45

Do you still jump now?

SPEAKER_00: 33:46

No, no, hell no. You uh once you have a kid, once you have a wife that wants you to like recover and heal and take care of yourself for longevity, it's really a hard fucking sell. Yeah, man, I got you. She lets me do a lot of shit, but that's one of the things where I'm like, I'm not gonna push it on this one.

SPEAKER_01: 34:03

Like, how do you justify going jumping on the weekends and stuff?

SPEAKER_00: 34:06

Oh man, dude, I feel like it's the craziest thing. So, like, I I'm really big. Um, like I said, New Year's, I'm gonna go do something hard. I'm gonna go do bring in either an insane ruck for distance. I'm really into doing something difficult at the beginning and at the end of the year. Nice, man. That's cool. And I have a wonderful spouse that supports me on these endeavors, but I realize that if I'm gonna take time away to go do these cool things, I gotta, I gotta put on the warrant officer hat and be like, hey, risk assessment. You know, I gotta be smart about this. I have a kid now, I have a wife. Like uh, as much as like I want to push the envelope, you know, maybe I dial it back. Maybe for me, it's just I go on a ruck. I go hang out with a friend and go do a long ruck. I'm not gonna do a marathon anytime soon. Need to get Dr. Bosley to get me on some fucking peptides. So it's a big, big shout out to the sponsor, Precision Wellness Group. Not only did they do a hormone optimization, but they're now doing peptides, and my knees fucking need it. Because uh I did there's a um there's an endurance run back in um the the uh seventh group AO called the Savage, um, the Savage Loop. Ran it last year, uh, only made it to the marathon, and it was amazing. It was a lot of fun. And uh I was training up for it again, and uh yeah, my knee, my left knee standard.

SPEAKER_01: 35:30

Now, when you say you made it to the marathon, you actually ran a marathon.

SPEAKER_00: 35:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 35:34

And then people were running after that.

SPEAKER_00: 35:36

Well, yeah, it's a savage loop goes, it could continue. Like the marathon is just like the halfway. Like, yay, congratulations. You you you participated. That was just a part you survived. You didn't make the full loop. But it's still fun because I ran it with a couple friends, um, and it was what it like I said, you gotta do hard things and it was enjoyable, and uh, you know, recovered, continue working out, and then started training for it again this year, and uh the old knee isn't quite doing it. So I'm gonna be passing on this one coming up, but uh, I'm not giving up because I got Dr. Bosley, the best guy out there in the peptide game now, but some pharmaceuticals.

SPEAKER_01: 36:15

I love rucking. Rucking is therapeutic for me, man. Just getting out there. I don't I don't I and I don't walk with music or anything. I just walk and get lost in my thoughts.

SPEAKER_00: 36:25

Dude, there's so not to get philosophical with you, but the stoics and even uh if you look in the Bible, it tells you to start off your day. If you want clarity, if you want to figure something out, you go on a walk. Go on a walk. Uh and and people, we get so lost in the fact that we gotta put on the headphones, we gotta listen to this, gotta listen to a podcast. There's a time and a place for it, I get it, but you will you will have more breakthroughs for whatever you're trying to get through, whether it's a life problem, whether it's a business problem. If you just wake up early and go on a walk, just go on a walk, do a mile, two miles, hell, do three if you can, and then just let the problem solve itself. Um you, I mean, I didn't get, you know, I don't, I'm a sole entrepreneur. I do this all on my own. And with Chat GPT, that's my other business partner. Help me with my business plan. Absolutely. Yeah. But I sit there and I get in these problem sets where I'm like, hey, I gotta do X, Y, and Z all at the same time next week. How do I figure this out? How do I add all the things I have to do and put them on the docket and how do I, you know, reach out to this person to make this happen? And I'll sit there and just go for a walk. Start off the day with a walk. And if you and I guarantee you'll be able to solve at least one or two, or just get to a point where you're not stressed about it, where you can see the abil the ability to see through the problem and be able to say, you know what, I might be able to solve right now. Going to. I'm going to solve it.

SPEAKER_01: 37:56

Do you treat it kind of like so, you know, at the range we're taught hit that 50-meter target first, that's your most threat. Do you kind of treat it like that?

SPEAKER_00: 38:05

Yep. That's where it is, because when you're worried and stressed about something, all you're focused on is the entirety of the problem set. I've got to travel, I've got to do this, these people aren't giving me this information that I need. This asshole's hitting me up for this information and wants this. There's always this want, want, want, want, and not enough of the focus of like, hey, motherfucker, if it's important to you, give me forecast the time to get back to you. Don't just drop a request. So you everything's right here in the forefront of your mind, and you're thinking, oh my God, it's impossible. You go on a walk and you start focusing on like, what do I need to do today? Maybe my best for today is I just take care of this. And now I start strategizing. Well, then if I pull the string logically, if I take care of this, then I can take care of this. And then this actually helps take care of this over here. But if you're like me, and I think it's a vast majority of people, when you get overwhelmed, when you get over, when you get task saturated, it feels like the entire world is caving in and you might give away the anxiety. So I will tell you right now, free chicken, take this, try it out today. Write out everything you gotta do. Write it out or use the iPad. That's I personally enjoy the iPad. Got it right here, brother. Yeah, yeah. Write it all out. Put it out on paper and then go for a walk and you'll come back and be like, I can take care of this, this, and this. And give yourself grace, man. That's one thing that nobody taught us as kids, as young men, uh, that I'm now trying to help inspire and coach people with is give everybody grace. Even the people that are not friendly to you, even people that are absolute assholes, be able to understand. It's uh at some point, you gotta see the world as hurt people, hurt people. If someone's being a complete fucking asshole, maybe it's not you. Maybe they're dealing with something. And don't internalize it.

SPEAKER_01: 39:53

Yeah, sometimes people just having a bad day, man. I get it. Yeah, absolutely. So you gotta do a lot of deconfliction here, don't you? Don't you?

SPEAKER_00: 40:00

Dog. All day, every day. All day, every day. But it's it's it's it's it's better to be, and this is it's been traveling on social media, but what a privilege. This is not my own thoughts. These aren't my words. I didn't come up with this. I'm not a brilliant thinker. I believe that the original concept of this comes from uh stoicism. Um, but what a privilege it is to be burdened by something that you prayed for. Hmm, absolutely. Like you, you, you stayed up and you prayed and you prayed a novella, or you prayed and and and you you you spoke to the saints, or you pulled out your rosary, and you did rosaries every day to ask for this, and the world unfolds and the prayers are answered, and the work can seem overwhelming, but you prayed for it. And it's okay to say, hey, I'm I'm fucking task saturated, but be happy. Be happy that there's work to do. Be happy that you're putting food on the table. This doesn't, none of this comes easy. You know this. You're you're in this world too. I think when you decide to be vulnerable enough to share something like this with the world, it comes with a lot of work. It comes with a lot to do. And it can be intimidating and it can definitely make you feel like, fuck, I'm not doing enough. But if you're passionate about something, you put one foot in front of the other. And if for like any other profession, I don't care if it's making cheesesteaks at the cheesesteak factory. If that's what you love and that's what you're proud to do every morning, every day, you get up and you put on that hat and you're like, man, I can't wait to get to that factory. I'm gonna make the best fucking cheesesteaks and you fucking do it. Yeah, brick by brick, baby. Exactly, man. Yeah. You know, there's a natural segue into this. How did you what did this come about? Like, you're you serve in the military, you get out. At what point did you say, I'm gonna create something for veterans, service members, and amplify this voice?

SPEAKER_01: 42:02

I think when I got out, I was what I should have done was take a knee, face out, and drink some water, but I didn't. I got out October, December, I was in the oil fields working in North Dakota. Damn. Working 12 hours a day, six days a week. Now, granted, it was good money, you know, it was just depressing because I was you're just out there by yourself, and you go from being a part of a team, having camaraderie, uh teaching, mentoring, training soldiers to boom, you train you know, you you do it for an exuberant amount of time, and then you get out and you're just by yourself in a truck hauling oil. Just going and and we worked a lot at nights, so it was just a night, it was cold. I I'm from Florida, so I wasn't used to negative 30 degrees. So Yeah, man, just so doing that luckily, well, I wouldn't say luckily, but the they lost their contract because it got like a lot of guys were doing safety violations. So I ended up moving back here, and it's just I couldn't find my purpose yet. So I was just going job, worked at Lowe's delivering appliances. Uh I went and got my CDL with my hazmat and tanker. Well, that was before I went to the oil fields, I got that, but when I came back, uh I just had a friend who knew the general manager at Lowe's and could get me a job really quick. So that's why I took that job. Then I didn't feel fulfilled there. I was just, you know, working. And then I ended up getting a job hauling fuel, uh going to the bulk places in Nashville, grabbing fuel and then delivering it to uh different gas stations. So I did that for a while, but still, man, I wasn't fulfilled. This I felt like this is not my purpose. Um, I didn't feel a part of a team. So one of my really good friends, um he started Swaggy Vets, which is uh our logo. Uh and he said, Man, I need you to come. I need somebody I could trust. I've I've known him since 2004. We've been best friends. And he said, Man, I want to I wanna bring you on the I want you to be my business partner to help me. So, okay. So we started strategizing and said, you know, we need to start a podcast because this business is for helping veterans. By veterans for veterans. So we started the podcast just to get generate some some eyes. So now that our podcast is getting a little some good trajectory to it, we just started a 501c3, so I give it nation. Um we're getting into just a bunch of other stuff. Just to help veterans, man, and and that's what we're doing. Uh actually just we just got an email from the Wounded Warrior Project. They want to do a collaboration on some stuff. So I gotta we have a meeting with them soon, so we're gonna see what that what kind of fruit that bears.

SPEAKER_00: 45:27

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 45:28

So and then yeah, man, we just we got a lot of stuff coming. So, yeah, I just found my purpose again. I got a uh a breath of fresh air in my lungs, and now I feel like I have a purpose in life, and I'm headed in the direction that I needed to go. I just, you know, fell off the path, but now I feel like I'm back on the path, you know?

SPEAKER_00: 45:50

Yeah. You hit on two things that are huge, which is identity and purpose, man. The um every everybody goes through it. Um I know. I know you're listening out there and you're still there and you're like, dude, fuck you. I know who I am, I'm not gonna struggle with it. Trust me, I've seen everybody. Sergeant major, group commanders, everybody deals with it because you're a person of service who wore a uniform, whether it be four years, two years, 20, 20 plus years. You got up every day and you had a mission. Even if that mission meant going to the dining facility and scrubbing the floors. You had a fucking mission. The day you transition out, you have to find a new mission. You have to find a new purpose. What better way than find something that's of service? Because the very at the very core of you as a veteran, as a service member, is somebody that deeply cares about service. And I know some of you are like, fuck no, I'm here for the college money. I know, I know. I've served with a lot of you guys. And the one thing I will tell you is in a few years afterwards, you will find any excuse to meet up with your friends and say, man, I'm so proud of what we did. And you should be, but understand that you're a person of service. Diving into the civilian world, take a knee. Like right now, like one of the things that you share too, like Bradley, like jumping into a job like that, you're very lucky. You're very and you probably dealt with it. You probably dealt with a little bit of depression, you probably dealt with a lot of a lot of the voices saying, like, fuck, you're alone.

SPEAKER_01: 47:23

Like Yeah, and I was going through problems in my marriage back then. So I I felt like the word was on my shoulders. I didn't know how to problem solve and deconflict, because this is stuff I've never dealt with, you know. Going from doing something for almost two decades to just something else. It's like, it's like, you know, you're on those roller coasters, they come to a screech and halt. That's how I kind of felt, man, with my life. So I really and I we advocate this so much. I had to go sit on somebody's couch and I had to talk, man. You know, mental health. I've never done this in my life. You know, being in the 82nd, you're taught or even in the airborne unit, and even a tier one operator like you, you're taught the mission comes first. The soldiers come first. You know, you need to put your problems aside so you can be an effective leader. You know, I I somebody had to pull me to the side and said, hey man, you're just a number. You know, you need to take care of yourself. And I I and I'm fortunately I did, but it was I was like 11 years in the military by then. So, you know, I was just trying to grab my bearings after that and start taking care of myself. So it was it was definitely a hard transition for me, man. Like bad. I I see why people drink, I see why people turn to drugs. I really see it, man. If I didn't have a strong mindset, I would have probably succumbed to that also.

SPEAKER_00: 49:02

It's true, man. And the other thing that we when nobody keys in on, I mean, we're starting to now. We you are a whole human being. You have to look at the entirety of your life when it comes to addressing mental health issues. Yeah, I had chaotic childhood, extremely chaotic, but we normalize things. I didn't address it till I was on my way out of the military. I and it was so deeply embedded. The problems you experienced developing as a kid, the trauma you go through as a young kid in a in a home of abuse will impact you for the rest of your life. You may not know it yet, you may not acknowledge it, but it will. You can walk through life, and and nobody knew it. It's not like I walked through this in your face. Nobody knows because you hide it, you push it down. But then you go to combat and you see things and you experience things. You're dealing with things like moral injury, you're doing doing work that is hard for the human mind to comprehend. And when you have, when you reach that limit, you're going to break. Everyone breaks. It's just a part of being human. And there's nothing wrong with reaching out and asking for help. It's one of the greatest signals that you can do, one of the biggest things of strength that we have to understand right now, the biggest signs is vulnerability. Being vulnerable enough to say, you know what, I'm going to get help. Because I'll tell you, uh, you the signs will start coming out long before you retire. And if you want to stay in that career field, if you want to be that best platoon sergeant that has soldiers that want to be in your platoon, or you want to be that team sergeant which you know everybody looks up to and everybody wants to be on that team, you need to address your issues. Because when you don't, you have problems like anger management, emotional regulation. I just made a post about um, you know, a lot of a lot of things that I advocate with is through humor. And in one of the posts I made, somebody's like, yeah, you know, this is funny, but uh I hate my platoon sergeant because he is so emotionally uh unregulated. He's just angry all the time. And it's like, give him grace. Give that guy grace because he's going through it. The angriest people are the ones that need the most help.

SPEAKER_01: 51:18

Yeah. I remember, man, um right back when we were deploying a lot, I had a good buddy, SF guy. I'm not, I'm not gonna say any names, but he he was a rock star man, had everything going for him. He was an E7, he's about to get promoted. I think he was a I think he was an Echo, maybe. But he he was about to get promoted. They was about to give him a team team sergeant slot, and he was about to deploy to get that big back then they got like the big hundred thousand dollar bonus.

SPEAKER_00: 51:55

The devil's money.

SPEAKER_01: 51:56

Yeah, but you know, he was going through a lot in his marriage, man, and he drank and got a DUI, and they snatched everything from him, man. His promotion, his slot he was gonna get, they didn't let him re-enlist. I was like, oh man, just because you were having problems, man, you know, I felt so bad for him, but eventually he got some help. But it's just to see something of that magnitude affect your life like that, I'm like, man, this is crazy, bro.

SPEAKER_00: 52:26

Yep. Yeah, it happens, man, more often than people think. And that's when you have to realize that there were probably signs a lot longer before that is that incident. There were probably some signs that were out there, and we're all humans, we're all dealing with complex issues in our own life, but if we could just be a little bit more aware of our friend's struggle, even the most, you know, dog faced, stoic dudes, there are some signs. And one of the things I realized early on is if you if you have a friend that drinks a lot, say something. Be willing to step up and say, hey man, why do you drink so much? We have now lost more service members after the GWAT than we did during the GWAT. And more often than not, those suicides are directly connected to alcohol. That's the thing that breaks my heart. That's the reason why I don't drink, that's the reason why I don't promote it, I don't advocate for it. It is no, there's there's nothing wrong if you enjoy drinking. If you enjoy and you can moderate it, and you, you know, you go out and you have a few drinks, you drink with the boys during a football game, whatever, that's cool. Stories shape culture, they build trust, and when they're told the right way, they move people to action. That's what we do at Security Hall Media. We don't just produce content, we create authentic, impactful, and purpose-driven storytelling. Podcasters, nonprofits, brands, and leaders who are on a mission. For people who've lived real experiences and want their message to actually matter. From podcast production and video to strategic storytelling and distribution, we help you clarify your voice, elevate your brand, and connect with the audience you're trying to serve. You have a story worth telling and a purpose behind it. Security Hall Media is here to help you tell it the right way. Click the link in the episode description to learn more today. Be willing to watch out for your friends because one of the easiest things for us to lean into for coping is alcohol. I know that nearly bit me. It was one of the things when I was struggling, when I was at my worst, that was the only thing I told myself, well, it's because I I needed to go to sleep. Like, how many of us use that excuse? I've used it before.

SPEAKER_01: 54:38

I used to be, yeah, I used to be, I used to drink quite a bit. You know, it just numbed your pain and you're able to just fall asleep. But I mean, what's what's gonna happen? You just the problems are gonna be there when you wake up and you're gonna have a hangover with a headache dealing with it.

SPEAKER_00: 54:55

Exactly. It doesn't make anything better, man. And I think that a lot of us, if we just stopped, we just pause and and and just thought for a minute, like, why do I drink? What why do I find myself attracted to drinking? And if you just think for yourself, if you just give a few moments to just pause and reflect on that, you might find yourself saying, you know what, maybe I'm I'm not gonna drink as much or as often as I do. Because if you're if you're worried about performance, if you're worried about health, if you're if you wear a whoop strap and you're always measuring every bit of your your workout, it impacts your endurance, it impacts your recovery, it impacts so many different things. It's it's an it's not a there's no positives to it. So just throwing it out there, take it, leave it, tell me the fuck off. Let me know. Send me a text. If you're uh if you're listening on Spotify, we have our text feature. Let me know what you feel about it right here, or or scan the QR code right here. Let me know what you think. I want to hear your feedback. I think it's an issue that more of us need to talk about. I'm not advocating for you to be a completely um, you know, alcohol-free if that's your thing. I'm not. Just asking you to think about it a little bit. I think there's time and place for everything. I would much rather you use something like medicinal marijuana. I think there's a lot more positives to that. It helped me on my journey. Um, I don't smoke anymore, but you know what, when I needed it, it felt a lot better utilizing that than reaching for a bottle.

SPEAKER_01: 56:16

What do you think about psychedelics? I heard that helps out a lot too.

SPEAKER_00: 56:20

A hundred percent. But, and I'm actually doing an episode on this today. Um I am a big proponent for it. Five MEO DMT changed me in a way that few things could. And I did everything first. Uh I took an approach, I was very methodical. I wanted to go through everything I could to get better that I could control. Meditation, mindfulness, um, certified mindfulness coach. I've been doing it for for years now. I think it gives you a lot of control in your journey. And breath work can give you a lot more control and make you connect with your body in a way that a lot of us don't or fail to acknowledge because our we're not self-aware and we're not present when we're in service. That's just a truth. And if you can practice mindfulness, present moment awareness, and learn to do some breath work, you will finally tap into a better version of yourself and understand how to connect with yourself. Uh, it's a truth. And I didn't have access to a lot of drugs while I was still in service. When I was going through my crisis, I was still in the military. I didn't have access to marijuana. I didn't have access to psychedelics because DOD policy is very, like, very, very strict on that. And I said, I'm not gonna piss hot, I'm not gonna ruin the end of my career. I'm already leaving. I was still struggling with leaving. I'm already leaving the service having so much that I felt was undone. I'm not gonna leave the service uh and have my service be tainted because I I piss hot for a controlled substance.

SPEAKER_01: 57:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 57:56

Because that was not something I was willing to do.

SPEAKER_01: 57:58

Once I got out, especially in the community you were in.

SPEAKER_00: 58:01

100%. And once one, I mean, all it takes, like, and you know it, all it takes is that one thing. One thing you piss hot and you're done. So it was a known thing that I wasn't gonna do. When I got out, everything was suddenly available. So many organizations, but I still took the same approach to think, to talk, to reach out, to talk to places like Sunstone Therapies, one of the only places where they're doing clinical trials that you can do with veterans. And the one thing that stuck to me in all my research was still assigned and five MEO DMT. And rather than continue to pull the threads and say, well, I'm gonna just go do this. I realize I still have a lot of control in my day-to-day life that I need to understand. Like I have to understand my emotional regulation. I have to understand, you know, the get control of my anxiety, get control of my depression, the suicide, uh, suicide ideology. Like, understand where these thoughts come from, work through this process. It's a lot of work. It's not easy, but it's the best work you can do. And I I went in the counseling, I went in the treatment centers, and I did all those things. And then finally, an opportunity came for 5MEO DMT, and I took it. And it was one of the best experiences of my life.

SPEAKER_01: 59:19

Yeah, I was gonna ask, what was that like, man? I really think it's a good idea.

SPEAKER_00: 59:21

It was absolutely something that you always hear it's a sacred sacred medicine, and you're connecting with something deeper that that is a religious experience, and it 100% is. It is the the best way I can describe it if if if you've if you've ever watched Interstellar, there's a point where he's traveling into the black hole gargantua, and that vibration and that complete separation from the ship. It removes you from this experience that you're in right now, this right here in this moment, and takes you to something else. And you have an intentionality going into it. I'm a I want to go in there. And I want here's my list of things. This is my intentions. This is what I want to go. I feel that I'm still hung up on this. I want to see this. And the medicine says, that's not what we're going to do. This is what you need to see. This is the experience you're going to have. And it's, you know, I did five, five sessions all back to back. And the first one's very gentle, slowly dropping you deeper and deeper and deeper and deeper. And you're experiencing and seeing things. Like I saw the version of me that was an absolute piece of shit. And it was a representation of a really horrible, ugly fucking thing. And I realized like, oh, that's me though. That's me though. I don't have to choose to be that, but that's that's the version of me. Fuck. Like, okay, I'm going to be a dad. I I never felt I had an understanding of what that meant because I didn't have an experience with my biological father to give me that understanding of like, this is what a father should be like. This is what it should feel like to be loved and held and supported by a father. And it gave me that experience by putting me back in a time and place where I was actually with my biological father. Like as a kid. I remember because I had I had pictures of all these moments, but because my biological mother was vindictive, all the the his head was cut out of all those pictures. Not being able to see him, not even not being able to understand what was the context of this photo. I experienced all those moments as if I was in that same little little kid, like there with his father, in those experiences, in the park, in home. And that's something I never had. I never had a concrete memory of having a positive father who picked me up, held me, and wanted to be, you know, like, oh, this is my son. This is my brother. Never had that. The medicine gave me that. It gave me the ability to see that moment and travel. It sounds crazy to know, but to somebody that's never done it. Travel outside of this experience through time and see something that you desperately need it to experience so that you can know that you have the capability to be a father. Like that's what I needed. I didn't all the whole list, all the intentions of all the things that I wanted to do, never even went through any of it. I saw everything I needed in order to be a father because my kid was born like just a few weeks later. So I did this right before my little one came into this world.

SPEAKER_02: 1:02:44

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_00: 1:02:45

Like so that I wasn't even anchoring on needing to have that experience. And I came out of that, and it was life-changing, absolutely life-changing.

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:56

So that kind of shifted your mindset when you had your your kid? Absolutely, because I had a lot of fear.

SPEAKER_00: 1:03:01

Anybody that's ever, and it I I've I've heard this from a lot of people that came from a very abused background. You have a big underlying under underneath the excitement of expecting to have that little one, there is a deep fear that you don't know or have the capacity to love or be a father. Like there's a scary part of you that's like, fuck. The figures that raised me were monsters, were demonic, horrible human beings, like disgusting human beings, like full stop, don't have a connection with any uh biological mother or the man that she married. Horrible people. And you have this big fear that that's a part of you. That experience showed me, like, no, dude, that's not a part of you. You are not that. You're completely different. Those people, they're nowhere near you. You're a kind, loving, wonderful human being. You have the capacity to be a nurturer, to be a father figure. And all the all my life, I didn't want to have kids. Whether I admitted it or not, I didn't want to have kids because of that underlying deep thought of like, no, because I went through all this. Yeah. And it wasn't until later in my life I met my wife. And then then I realized, oh shit, what's what's more important in life? Walking around, uh, you know, being in the military, earning badges, earning skill sets. No, the most important thing in life, you can you can be a the most important thing, in my opinion, in after all my journey, uh after everything I've gone through, the most important, impactful journey that you can have as a man is being a husband and being a father. Like being devoted, like being able to get back with your faith, tapping into that and being a husband, being a father. That's it. That's the last, that is the absolute thing. If if I look back at everything that I experienced, the good leaders, the good dudes that got out of the service and weren't impacted, didn't have the mental health struggles, or maybe they did, but they rebounded a lot faster. They were concrete in their faith, they were concrete in the role as a father, and they were a damn good husband. And I wasn't any of that. I didn't have any of that. I I shrugged that off. I had divorced. I had all these times where I was chasing the wrong women. And then I found my wife. And then through all the situations, through all the stuff I went through, then I finally, it's like the aha moment. Like, oh shit. None of this shit helped me when I was going through my my journey, my downfall, my spiral. No. But if getting plugged back into faith, finding my wife, being willing to come to her, being willing to realize that I needed to trust and have faith in in God again, like that shit. That's what helped me. That's awesome, man. I'm glad to hear that. I love that for you. Yeah, so I love to share that and and let people know. But on the backside, what I'm talking about with uh my my friend a little later today, is you hear stories like this, um, or other stories of ayahuasca and Ibogaine, and you hear miraculous healing, miraculous journeys, and you say to yourself, I want that. And I will tell you right now, when you heal, when you recover, the first thing you want to do is you want to grab that and be like, I'm gonna heal everybody. That's not your place. That's not my place. I learned that the hard way when I started really leaning into mindfulness and meditation. I wanted everybody to meditate. I wanted everybody to be mindful. No, some people aren't in a place where they want to hear that. They're gonna quickly tell you, shut the fuck up. Just be present enough to share your journey. Be able to just share a little bit what you went through. Now we have service members that are actively trying to give you know these experiences to other service members, and it's an issue. You shouldn't be trying to be the healer when you yourself aren't all the way through your journey, or nonprofits, medical, you know, there are regulations and guidance and medical providers that should be present. Doing an IBogaine or ayahuasca experience in somebody's basement, probably not the best thing if you're still active duty. I'm just saying it. You have to be willing to use the resources that are out there because the the number one thing to save my life when I was actively suicidal, and I actively had a plan, it wasn't medicinal marijuana, it wasn't psychedelics, it was me being vulnerable with one mental health provider, and she finally had my vulnerability and my consent to send me somewhere to get help. That's okay, that's awesome, man. That's that's the reality of it. But guys see the power behind these substances, and now they want to figure out a way to get their buddies in. They want to try to do it while they're still in. And that is dangerous. That is a dangerous and there we're we can see a knee-jerk reaction. We're already having a hard time fighting for our veterans to get access to this stuff. Don't go out there and be a bad steward of this medicine by trying to do something through uh you know the loopholes out there.

SPEAKER_02: 1:08:13

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 1:08:14

Yeah, that's uh it's a big issue we're seeing.

SPEAKER_01: 1:08:16

What does I begin do? The same as the psychedelics?

SPEAKER_00: 1:08:21

Psychedelic, um they're different compounds, they have different reactions. Um Trevor from uh Ambio Life is a great person to bring on. He can break it down a hundred percent. Okay. Um they're different. I mean, these things are powerful, powerful medicines. Powerful, powerful medicines. You can experience a lot of things. If you're not being monitored by health providers, it can be a very bad experience. It's not these tools, just like psilocybin and 500 DMT, they you have the idea that they're easily accessible because any like magic mushrooms have been around the the culture for a long time. Like people go on trips all the time. Well, you can just go have psilocybin and you'll have a journey and it'll change your life forever. Maybe not. Maybe not. Maybe you you do it in a proper setting, state and setting. Like it's you should be doing it with guidance. And if the guidance is an active duty service member that didn't experience and he's trying to get you to go do it in a basement, maybe not the best way to do it.

SPEAKER_03: 1:09:29

Maybe not the best way.

SPEAKER_00: 1:09:31

Maybe not. Like there, there are there are individuals that are trusted with the medicine that should be able to give you guidance on how to do it. But if you're still active duty, if you're suffering, there's real resources you can use right now that won't impact or harm your service. Um, and until the DOD gives clear hands, like signal that says, hey, you can do all these medicines, don't jeopardize your career. Just don't. It's not worth it. There's plenty of other resources you can use right now. If you're sp if you're a Green Beret and you need help, Special Forces Foundation, fuck my editor right here. QR code. Put it in there.

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:10

Put that QR code. Uh Special Forces Foundation, they just had a big thing in Nashville.

SPEAKER_00: 1:10:14

That's the Green Beret Foundation. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:15

Oh, the Green Beret. Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 1:10:18

I'll I'll edit that because I don't fucks with them people. My bad, bro. And then I'll point out. No, the Special Forces Foundation is a proud sponsor of Security Hub Podcast. Um, and uh I I I love what they're doing. Grassroots approach, their QRF program, led by uh Cody Half-Pop, is amazing. Um, really, really, really, really important holiday season. I'm gonna rush this to get it out there. But um, you know this, man. Like it holidays are already tough for a lot of people in America. Veterans that like to seclude, that like to hide out and turn off their phone and disappear, they're struggling too. Yeah. Reach out. That's uh the big thing that like right now, if you're listening, reach out to three friends today. Reach out the entirety of this holiday season. Start right now. Just have a talk, text, call, whatever. Don't make it superficial. Go a little bit deeper, man.

SPEAKER_01: 1:11:25

Like I'm I I make it a I make it a habit of mine. People that I hold dear close, I always reach out to them at least once a week. I'll send them a text, hey, just thinking about you. Hope everything's good, you know, hit me up when you can.

SPEAKER_00: 1:11:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:11:42

And just to know, because I get that text from, you know, one or two people, and it makes me feel good that they're thinking about me. Somebody actually cares about me, you know.

SPEAKER_00: 1:11:51

Absolutely, man. That's uh that's the one thing I've noticed with our older vets, too, man. The connection is the most important thing, man. Yeah, it's it breaks my heart when I I see older vets and all they want to do is just talk, man. I had a really good friend, he reached out, like, man, my my neighbor wants to go do this, this, and I'm like, I don't know, it's Veterans Day. And I'm like, dude, like you would make that dude's entire year if you just went to the Veterans Day lunch with him. Because they look at the younger generation with admiration. Even though we feel like our service doesn't match up to what a World War II veteran, they look at us like we're fucking heroes. And I'm like, bro, it it's it's the other way around. Like we we have to support each other. So if if um if you got anybody near you that's an older veteran by themselves, and there's a lot, there's still a lot out there, reach out to them, man, be willing to drop by.

SPEAKER_01: 1:12:48

Absolutely. And what one of the big things we advocate for is my counterpart, he's he's a member of a VFW, and we're trying to get the younger guys to go to these VFWs and be a part of it because they don't really know the social media like that. They're older, they don't know how to promote stuff, they don't know how to navigate the internet like that. So we actually need the younger veterans to go out there and help these VFWs, you know, navigate stuff that they need to navigate, promoting, going events, whatever it may be, because a lot of these places are closing, man. Just like you said, what do we like to do? We like to sit down, we like to fellowship with each other. We like to talk about the old times, talk about deployments, talk about this. It's therapy for us. And that's one of the main reasons why we started a podcast, too, you know. So just talking, man.

SPEAKER_00: 1:13:47

It's it's just great. Dude, it is. You know, now more than ever, we need it. We're divided on so many fronts, so many different issues, so many fucking different things. But I'm telling you, we have more in common than we think.

SPEAKER_01: 1:14:00

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00: 1:14:01

The news and 24-hour media cycle doesn't, it's isn't a real representation of how most Americans think or act. It really isn't. It's sound bites of the most negative shit out there. I guarantee you if you just talk to somebody, man, veteran, civilian, just connect with somebody. It'll do good for you. It'll do good for you. Like this, this is good, but nothing beats an in-person conversation with somebody like that. Yeah, yeah, bro.

SPEAKER_01: 1:14:26

Yeah, because a lot of the times you see crap on the on the internet, man, you're like, I don't see that happening in everyday life.

SPEAKER_02: 1:14:34

What are they talking about?

SPEAKER_01: 1:14:36

You know? It's crazy, man.

SPEAKER_00: 1:14:38

Yeah. Just want to spin us up, man. That's that's the crazy thing. Divide and conquer.

SPEAKER_01: 1:14:42

I actually like I actually love the name of your podcast, Security Hulk, because you can apply that to life. You know, stop. Look at yourself, look at your surroundings, you know, and then uh whatever you need to fix, you fix. Uh, you got something going on over here. Let's let's go ahead and engage that, you know, whatever, man.

SPEAKER_00: 1:15:01

Seals, man. That's the one thing I I realized. It's a mindfulness exercise. Like 54321. Like, what can you smell? What can you see? What can you taste? Like, what can you touch right now? Ground yourself in the present moment. And I didn't realize that we were doing that through so much of our training, so many times you went out and practiced patrolling with your platoon or your company. You know, you transition off a vehicle or your infill platform, and everybody moves into your little security haul. What are you doing? You're attenuating your senses to that new environment. And I'm like, we've been doing mindfulness in so many different aspects of our military career, nobody calls it that. When I was a sniper, didn't realize, like, hey, you get too if you get too sucked in to that one target and you can't see trace, instructor's gonna say, hey, come up off class, box breathe, take a few deep breaths, close your eyes, focus, bring yourself back here, fucking bring down your heart rate. All right, get back on a get back on target, get back on the glass. Oh shit. Mindfulness right there. Never realized until I got out. And it's like all these little, all these little principles, all these little exercises we've been doing, you can apply it to your everyday life. You can still do it, man.

SPEAKER_01: 1:16:10

Yeah, yeah. That's awesome, bro.

SPEAKER_02: 1:16:13

I'm glad you you got that awareness.

SPEAKER_00: 1:16:15

Yeah, now, and that's the thing, man. And as we close it down, man, I always like to tell people like don't be frustrated about the lessons learned, the hard fought lessons that now you're learning as a you know, 40-something year old man. It's great. The lessons you learn now aren't for you. They're for the next generation. Maybe it's not starting a podcast, maybe it's not starting a YouTube channel, maybe it's just connecting with one individual, mentoring one young man to go in the military and giving him those hard-learned lessons. Maybe that's it. Maybe that's a reason. So don't get mad about the fact that you're just now gaining clarity for so many of your issues. That's God working in his infinite wisdom. It's still going to benefit you. But the main reason why you're working so hard to get through this journey to get better, so you can pay it forward to the next cap. Maybe it's your own kids. Maybe it's your best friend that's still struggling, but your journey is not yours to hold on to and be selfish with it. It's to help others, man. Bradley, I can't thank you enough for being here today. If people want to connect, where can they check you out?

SPEAKER_01: 1:17:25

Um, you can go to our, we have a Swaggy Vets uh Facebook page. Uh that's where we do, we make announcements and stuff on there. Um go to Swaggy Vet's uh YouTube page. It's called Swaggy Vetts Network, and we named it a network because we're gonna roll out a bunch of different shows. We're gonna have Vet Talk where we talk to professionals like you were talking about that uh help veterans. Um we're gonna have the Life After Sports where we talk to athletes about you know it correlates to the military getting out and the mindset they use also. And uh, we got a couple other things we're doing. So our YouTube page is Swaggy Vets Network, if you want to go give us a follow. Um, we're actually gonna have uh Denny on the on the podcast soon. So I'm sure they've heard your story, but I really want to go in depth to you because a lot of stuff you've talked about on here, I really want to go a lot more in depth and kind of hammer down some stuff. So I really look forward to it, man.

SPEAKER_00: 1:18:22

Absolutely, man. I can't wait. And everybody listening, do me a favor, pause right now. You know the spiel, this thing's almost over. Go to the episode description, look at all those wonderful links. I put them in there just for you. I'm cool, I'll do that for you. Just one more favor, just click those links, follow, subscribe, share, leave a comment or two. And then one more thing, if you're a Green Beret and you're struggling or just need to connect, scan this QR code right here. Reach out to the Special Forces Foundation and they will take care of you. You've already served our nation, doing a pretty difficult job. It's only human to stumble, fall, and to suffer. So if you need help this holiday season, if you need connection, or you're a family of a Green Beret and needs help or resources, scan the QR code and reach out today. It's what we do, dog. We take care of people all day, every day.

SPEAKER_01: 1:19:11

Hey, and if you haven't subscribed to Security Hulk podcast, what are you waiting on?

SPEAKER_00: 1:19:15

Yeah, dude, come on. Come on. What are you doing? Come on. You'll sit there and binge watch the entire 50 Cent Vid Diddy show, but you won't subscribe to Security Hall.

SPEAKER_01: 1:19:28

We're trying to help people here, man.

SPEAKER_00: 1:19:30

That was a great show. I love the pettiness of 50. I've always loved him, and man, every every moment he could.

SPEAKER_01: 1:19:38

Hey, after this, um, are you gonna stop the recording? We still want to talk. Yeah, man. Yeah. For sure. We'll wrap it up. I want to pick your brain for a couple things.

SPEAKER_00: 1:19:46

Hell yeah. And on that note, thank you all for tuning in. I really appreciate you guys rallying around the sponsors. It means a lot to me. I'm Denny Caballero. This has been another amazing episode of Security Podcast. And until next time, take care. Care, see ya.